3.
The Chapter on Examination
1.
The Question on the Root of Duration
1. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the root of the past course of time, what is the root of the future course of time, what is the root of the present course of time?" "Of the past course of time, great king, and of the future course of time, and of the present course of time, ignorance is the root. With ignorance as condition, activities; with activities as condition, consciousness; with consciousness as condition, mentality-materiality; with mentality-materiality as condition, the six sense bases; with the six sense bases as condition, contact; with contact as condition, feeling; with feeling as condition, craving; with craving as condition, clinging; with clinging as condition, existence; with existence as condition, birth; with birth as condition, ageing and death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, displeasure, and anguish come to be. Thus the former end of this whole mass of suffering, of this course of time, is not discerned."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the root of duration is the first.
2.
The Question on the Former End
2. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'the former end is not discerned', give a simile for that." "Just as, great king, a man might place a small seed in the earth, and from that a sprout having arisen, gradually attaining growth, increase, and expansion, would give fruit. From that, having taken the seed, he might plant it again, and from that too a sprout having arisen, gradually attaining growth, increase, and expansion, would give fruit. Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the former end of the course of time is not discerned."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, there would be an egg from a hen, from the egg a hen, from the hen an egg. Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the former end of the course of time is not discerned."
"Give a further simile." The elder, having drawn a wheel on the ground, said this to King Milinda: "Is there, great king, an end to this wheel?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, these wheels were spoken of by the Blessed One: 'Dependent on the eye and forms, eye-consciousness arises; the meeting of the three is contact; with contact as condition, feeling; with feeling as condition, craving; with craving as condition, clinging; with clinging as condition, action; from action, the eye is born again.' Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir."
"'Dependent on the ear and sounds, etc. dependent on the mind and mental phenomena, mind-consciousness arises; the meeting of the three is contact; with contact as condition, feeling; with feeling as condition, craving; with craving as condition, clinging; with clinging as condition, action; from action, the mind is born again.' Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the former end of the course of time is not discerned."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the former end is the second.
3.
The Question on Discerning the End
3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'the former end is not discerned', what is that former end?" "Whatever, great king, is the past period, that is the former end." "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'the former end is not discerned', but, venerable sir, is the entire former end not discerned?" "Some, great king, is discerned, some is not discerned." "Which, venerable sir, is discerned, which is not discerned?" "Before this, great king, entirely in every way, in every manner, ignorance did not exist - this former end is not discerned; that which, not having been, comes into being, having been, disappears - this former end is discerned."
"Venerable Nāgasena, that which, not having been, comes into being, having been, disappears - does that not, being cut off at both ends, go to its end?" "If, great king, being cut off at both ends, it goes to its end, is it possible to make what is cut off at both ends grow?" "Yes, that too is possible to make grow." "I am not, venerable sir, asking this - is it possible to make grow from the end?" "Yes, it is possible to make grow."
"Give a simile." The elder gave him the simile of a tree, and the aggregates are the seeds of the whole mass of suffering.
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on discerning the end is the third.
4.
The Question on Activities Arising
4. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, are there any activities which are born?" "Yes, great king, there are activities which are born." "Which are those, venerable sir?" "When the eye exists, great king, and forms exist, eye-consciousness exists; when eye-consciousness exists, eye-contact exists; when eye-contact exists, feeling exists; when feeling exists, craving exists; when craving exists, clinging exists; when clinging exists, existence exists; when existence exists, birth exists; when birth exists, ageing and death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, displeasure, and anguish come to be; thus is the origin of this whole mass of suffering. When the eye is absent, great king, and forms are absent, eye-consciousness does not exist; when eye-consciousness is absent, eye-contact does not exist; when eye-contact is absent, feeling does not exist; when feeling is absent, craving does not exist; when craving is absent, clinging does not exist; when clinging is absent, existence does not exist; when existence is absent, birth does not exist; when birth is absent, ageing and death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, displeasure, and anguish do not exist; thus is the cessation of this whole mass of suffering."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on activities arising is the fourth.
5.
The Question on Existing Activities Arising
5. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, are there any activities which, not existing, are born?" "There are not, great king, any activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born, great king."
"Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, was this house in which you are sitting born not existing?" "There is nothing, venerable sir, here born not existing; it was born only existing. These timbers, venerable sir, were in the forest, and this clay was in the earth, and through the appropriate effort of women and men, thus this house came into being." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, whatever seed-plants and growing plants placed in the earth, gradually attaining growth, increase, and expansion, would give flowers and fruits, those trees were not born not existing; only existing were those trees born. Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing are those activities born."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, a potter, having extracted clay from the earth, makes various vessels, those vessels were not born not existing; they were born only existing. Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no sound-board of a lute, no hide, no trough, no neck, no head, no strings, no plectrum, and no appropriate effort of a man, would sound be produced?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a sound-board of a lute, there is hide, there is a trough, there is a neck, there is a head, there are strings, there is a plectrum, and there is appropriate effort of a man, would sound be produced?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no fire-stick, no fire-stick spindle, no fire-stick cord, no upper fire-stick, no rag, and no appropriate effort of a man, would that fire be produced?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a fire-stick, there is a fire-stick spindle, there is a fire-stick cord, there is an upper fire-stick, there is a rag, and there is appropriate effort of a man, would that fire be produced?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no gem, no sunshine, no cow-dung, would that fire be produced?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a gem, there is sunshine, there is cow-dung, would that fire be produced?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no mirror, no light, no face, would a reflection arise?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a mirror, there is light, there is a face, would a reflection arise?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on existing activities arising is the fifth.
6.
The Question on One Who Has Attained the Highest Knowledge
6. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is one who has attained the highest knowledge found?" "But who, great king, is this one called 'one who has attained the highest knowledge'?" "That which, venerable sir, is the soul inside that sees form with the eye, hears sound with the ear, smells odour with the nose, tastes flavour with the tongue, touches tangible object with the body, cognizes mental phenomena with the mind, just as we, seated here in the mansion, through whichever window we might wish to see, through that window we would see, through the eastern window too we would see, through the western window too we would see, through the northern window too we would see, through the southern window too we would see. Just so indeed, venerable sir, this soul inside, through whichever door it wishes to see, through that door it sees."
The elder said: "I will speak about the five doors, great king; listen to that, pay close attention. If the soul inside sees form with the eye, just as we, seated here in the mansion, through whichever window we might wish to see, through that window we would see just form, through the eastern window too we would see just form, through the western window too we would see just form, through the northern window too we would see just form, through the southern window too we would see just form, just so by this soul inside, with the ear too just form should be seen, with the nose too just form should be seen, with the tongue too just form should be seen, with the body too just form should be seen, with the mind too just form should be seen; with the eye too just sound should be heard, with the nose too just sound should be heard, with the tongue too just sound should be heard, with the body too just sound should be heard, with the mind too just sound should be heard; with the eye too just odour should be smelled, with the ear too just odour should be smelled, with the tongue too just odour should be smelled, with the body too just odour should be smelled, with the mind too just odour should be smelled; with the eye too just flavour should be tasted, with the ear too just flavour should be tasted, with the nose too just flavour should be tasted, with the body too just flavour should be tasted, with the mind too just flavour should be tasted; with the eye too just tangible object should be touched, with the ear too just tangible object should be touched, with the nose too just tangible object should be touched, with the tongue too just tangible object should be touched, with the mind too just tangible object should be touched; with the eye too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the ear too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the nose too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the tongue too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the body too just mental phenomena should be cognized?" "No indeed, venerable sir."
"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter. Or else, great king, just as we, seated here in the mansion, when these latticed windows are opened, with the great space facing outward, we see form more clearly, just so by this soul inside too, when the eye-doors are opened, with the great space, form should be seen more clearly; when the ears are opened, etc. when the nose is opened, etc. when the tongue is opened, etc. when the body is opened, with the great space, sound should be heard more clearly, odour should be smelled, flavour should be tasted, tangible object should be touched?" "No indeed, venerable sir."
"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter. Or else, great king, if this Dinna, having gone out, were to stand in the outer door-porch, would you know, great king, 'This Dinna, having gone out, is standing in the outer door-porch'?" "Yes, venerable sir, I know." "Or else, great king, if this Dinna, having entered inside, were to stand before you, would you know, great king, 'This Dinna, having entered inside, is standing before me'?" "Yes, venerable sir, I know." "Just so indeed, great king, would that soul inside, when flavour is placed on the tongue, know sourness or saltiness or bitterness or pungency or astringency or sweetness?" "Yes, venerable sir, he would know." "Would it know those flavours when they have entered inside - sourness or saltiness or bitterness or pungency or astringency or sweetness?" "No indeed, venerable sir."
"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter. Just as, great king, some man, having had a hundred pots of honey brought, having had a honey trough filled, having closed a man's mouth, were to throw him into the honey trough, would that man know, great king, whether the honey is good or not good?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason?" "Because, venerable sir, the honey has not entered his mouth."
"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter." "I am not competent to converse with you, a debater; please, venerable sir, explain the meaning."
The elder convinced King Milinda with a talk connected with the higher teaching: "Here, great king, dependent on the eye and forms, eye-consciousness arises; conascent with it are contact, feeling, perception, volition, unified focus, life faculty, and attention - thus these mental states arise from conditions; no one who has attained the highest knowledge is found here. Dependent on the ear and sounds, etc. Dependent on the mind and mental phenomena, mind-consciousness arises; conascent with it are contact, feeling, perception, volition, unified focus, life faculty, and attention - thus these mental states arise from conditions; no one who has attained the highest knowledge is found here."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on one who has attained the highest knowledge is the sixth.
7.
The Question on Eye-Consciousness and So On
7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" "Yes, great king, where eye-consciousness arises, mind-consciousness also arises there."
"Which indeed, venerable Nāgasena, arises first - eye-consciousness and afterwards mind-consciousness, or does mind-consciousness arise first and afterwards eye-consciousness?" "First, great king, eye-consciousness arises, afterwards mind-consciousness."
"Does indeed, venerable Nāgasena, eye-consciousness command mind-consciousness 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' or does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'?" "No indeed, great king, there is no conversation between them with each other."
"How, venerable Nāgasena, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" "Because of inclination, great king, and because of the door, and because of practice, and because of habituation."
"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of inclination, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, when the sky rains, by which way would the water go?" "By whichever way there is a slope, venerable sir, by that way it would go." "Then at another time the sky would rain, by which way would that water go?" "By whichever way, venerable sir, the former water went, that too would go by that way."
"Does indeed, great king, the former water command the latter water 'By which way I go, you too go by that way,' or does the latter water command the former water 'By which way you will go, I too will go by that way'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no conversation between them with each other; they go because of inclination." "Just so indeed, great king, because of inclination, where eye-consciousness arises, mind-consciousness also arises there; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of inclination."
"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of the door, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, suppose there were a king's border city with strong walls and gateways, with a single door, and from there a man wished to depart, by which way would he depart?" "By the door, venerable sir, he would depart." "Then another man wished to depart, by which way would he depart?" "By whichever way, venerable sir, the former man departed, he too would depart by that way."
"Does indeed, great king, the former man command the latter man 'By which way I go, you too go by that way,' or does the latter man command the former man 'By which way you will go, I too will go by that way'? "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no conversation between them with each other; they go because of the door." "Just so indeed, great king, because of the door, where eye-consciousness arises, mind-consciousness also arises there; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of the door."
"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of practice, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, suppose first one cart were to go, then by which way would a second cart go?" "By whichever way, venerable sir, the former cart went, that too would go by that way."
"Does indeed, great king, the former cart command the latter cart: 'By which way I go, you too go by that way,' or does the latter cart command the former cart: 'By which way you will go, I too will go by that way'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no conversation between them with each other; they go because of habit." "Just so indeed, great king, because of habit, where eye-consciousness arises, there mind-consciousness also arises; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness: 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness: 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of habit."
"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of repeated practice, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "Just as, great king, for a beginner in the branches of knowledge of seal-making, calculation, enumeration, and writing, there is slowness, but at a later time, because of repeated practice through careful action, there is no slowness. Just so indeed, great king, because of repeated practice, where eye-consciousness arises, there mind-consciousness also arises; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness: 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness: 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of repeated practice."
"Venerable Nāgasena, where ear-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" Etc. Where nose-consciousness arises, etc. Where tongue-consciousness arises, etc. Where body-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" "Yes, great king, where body-consciousness arises, there mind-consciousness also arises."
"Does indeed, venerable Nāgasena, body-consciousness arise first and mind-consciousness afterwards, or does mind-consciousness arise first and body-consciousness afterwards?" "Body-consciousness, great king, arises first, mind-consciousness afterwards."
"Does indeed, venerable Nāgasena, etc. there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of repeated practice."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on eye-consciousness and so on is the seventh.
8.
The Question on the Characteristic of Contact
8. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, where mind-consciousness arises, do contact and feeling also arise there?" "Yes, great king, where mind-consciousness arises, contact also arises there, feeling also arises there, perception also arises there, volition also arises there, applied thought also arises there, sustained thought also arises there, all phenomena with contact as chief also arise there."
"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of contact?" "Touching is the characteristic of contact, great king."
"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, two rams might fight; among them, just as one ram, so should the eye be seen; just as the second ram, so should matter be seen. Just as their collision, so should contact be seen."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, two hands might strike together; among them, just as one hand, so should the eye be seen. Just as the second hand, so should matter be seen. Just as their collision, so should contact be seen."
"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, two cymbals might strike together; among them, just as one cymbal, so should the eye be seen. Just as the second cymbal, so should matter be seen. Just as their collision, so should contact be seen."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the characteristic of contact is the eighth.
9.
The Question on the Characteristic of Feeling
9. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of feeling?" "Feeling has the characteristic of being felt, great king, and the characteristic of being experienced."
"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man might perform a service for a king, and the king, being pleased, might grant him an office; he, endowed and furnished with the five types of sensual pleasure by that office, might indulge himself; it might occur to him: 'Formerly I performed a service for the king, and the king, being pleased, granted me an office; on that account I feel this kind of feeling.'
"Or else, great king, some man, having done wholesome action, upon the body's collapse at death, might be reborn in a fortunate realm, in a heavenly world; and there, endowed and furnished with the five divine types of sensual pleasure, he might indulge himself; it might occur to him: 'Formerly I did wholesome action; on that account I feel this kind of feeling.' Thus indeed, great king, feeling has the characteristic of being felt and the characteristic of being experienced."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the characteristic of feeling is the ninth.
10.
The Question on the Characteristic of Perception
10. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of perception?" "Perceiving is the characteristic of perception, great king. What does it perceive? It perceives blue, it perceives yellow, it perceives red, it perceives white, it perceives crimson. Thus, great king, perceiving is the characteristic of perception."
"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a king's storekeeper, having entered the storehouse, having seen the royal treasures of blue, yellow, red, white, and crimson forms, perceives them. Thus, great king, perceiving is the characteristic of perception."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the characteristic of perception is the tenth.
11.
The Question on the Characteristic of Volition
11. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of volition?" "Volition has the characteristic of willing, great king, and the characteristic of constructing."
"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man, having prepared poison, might drink it himself and give it to others to drink, he himself would be afflicted, and others too would be afflicted. Just so indeed, great king, here a certain person, having willed unwholesome action through volition, upon the body's collapse at death, would be reborn in a realm of misery, an unfortunate realm, a nether world, in hell. And those who follow his example, they too, upon the body's collapse at death, are reborn in a realm of misery, an unfortunate realm, a nether world, in hell.
"Or else, great king, some man, having prepared together ghee, butter, oil, honey and molasses, might drink it himself and give it to others to drink, he himself would be happy, and others too would be happy. Just so indeed, great king, here a certain person, having willed wholesome action through volition, upon the body's collapse at death, is reborn in a fortunate realm, in a heavenly world. And those who follow his example, they too, upon the body's collapse at death, are reborn in a fortunate realm, in a heavenly world. Thus indeed, great king, volition has the characteristic of willing and the characteristic of constructing."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the characteristic of volition is the eleventh.
12.
The Question on the Characteristic of Consciousness
12. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of consciousness?" "Cognition is the characteristic of consciousness, great king."
"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a city guardian seated in the middle of a city crossroads would see a man coming from the eastern direction, would see a man coming from the southern direction, would see a man coming from the western direction, would see a man coming from the northern direction. Even so, great king, whatever form a man sees with the eye, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever sound he hears with the ear, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever odour he smells with the nose, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever flavour he tastes with the tongue, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever tangible object he touches with the body, that he cognizes with consciousness; whatever mental phenomenon he cognizes with the mind, that he cognizes with consciousness. Thus, great king, cognition is the characteristic of consciousness."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the characteristic of consciousness is the twelfth.
13.
The Question on the Characteristic of Applied Thought
13. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of applied thought?" "Absorption is the characteristic of applied thought, great king."
"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a carpenter fixes well-prepared wood into a joint, even so, great king, absorption is the characteristic of applied thought."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the characteristic of applied thought is the thirteenth.
14.
The Question on the Characteristic of Sustained Thought
14. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of sustained thought?" "Stroking is the characteristic of sustained thought, great king."
"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a bronze plate when struck afterwards resounds and reverberates, just as, great king, the striking, so should applied thought be seen. Just as the resounding, so should sustained thought be seen."
"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."
The question on the characteristic of sustained thought is the fourteenth.
The Sustained Thought Chapter is the third.
In this chapter there are fourteen questions.